MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Hi
Does anyone have any views on what type of varnish to use on the deck (and for me also in the cockpit).
I have read a huge amount of views online about twin pack (presumably epoxy) and single pack varnish and I am none the wiser. There are strong views about both types. Traditionalists say that twin pack varnishes are hugely expensive and a disaster when it comes to repairs or touching up later, and twin packers say that their product is vastly superior in terms of durability and UV protection.
What are you chaps using?
Realistically, my boat is going to spend quite a lot of time in the garage and when it comes out,with launching, recovery and sailing in confined spaces will get quite a few knocks, so I am tending towards the cheaper traditional single pack varnish which I can touch up easily.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Ah yes, I have decided to go ‘one pack’ for paints and varnishes, mostly so I can keep whatever I don’t use for touch ups etc. I must admit I have never done this before so no idea myself what the best route is.

MartinG

Member

Registered: 29 Mar 2020

Posts: 6

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Martin I'd stick with the single pack if I were you. I've had good results with the Coo-Var Yacht and Seaplane Varnish that Fyne Boats sells on the 10 ft tender I built before starting my "big" boat. Nice finish and dries pretty hard.

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Thanks very much Martin. I'll go with your recommendation, particulary as Coo-Var is made in Yorkshire - despite the unusual name!

MartinG

Member

Registered: 29 Mar 2020

Posts: 6

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

By heck tha knows! I happen to be a Yorkshireman too - from Beverley originally.

Here's a pic of the finish on my Duo dinghy. It's not brilliant but it's the only one less than 2Mb that will fit on here. It's obviously a nesting version and I can tell you it's an interesting experience building a perfectly good boat and then hacking it in half with a jigsaw.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

I can’t claim Yorkshire roots, but it was always a favourite place for my Granny, and Dad, and I have very fond memories of hiking trips there as a kid. Hawes and the area around there is a special place for the family.  Today’s efforts so far have been limited to glassing the underside of the deck. All I have learned there is don’t try and do it on the floor of your garage if you can find a better place! Particularly if it’s a bit windy and the neighbours beech hedge is shedding leaves. Suffice to say I am happy that it wasn’t the top surface that was being glassed, so all the tiny bits of leaf will not be seen.

Oh yes, and the other important milestone is that ‘Svale’ the Norwegian for Swallow has been approved of as a name! Thanks for the tip in that direction!

CrimeaRiver

Member

Registered: 3 Oct 2016

Posts: 18

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

This might help:-

https://angusrowboats.com/blogs/news/fi … g-geometry

---

Recidivist wooden surfboard builder!
Built a Kaholo 12' 6" SUP from plans
Built a NE Dory from plans

spclark

Member

From: "Driftless" Wisconsin USA

Registered: 19 Mar 2020

Posts: 465

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

This might help:-

Indeed it does, thanks!

Very nicely lays out the answers about geometery that've been puzzling me as my Waterlust project comes along!

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Glad you got the link you needed there SP! I don’t know much about the technicalities of rowing, so not of much help there. Today I put a second coat of gloss on the inside parts that will be hard to reach once the deck is on. I also shaped a few extra supports that will go between the fore and aft stringers to give a bit more support to the foredeck, so small people can sit on it. I also tested out a way of drawing the sides of the hull together, I used one of those straps you often see on trucks / for tying things down on roof racks, with a ratcheting device on it. Seems to work fine.

Pulling the hull into shape

Foredeck supports, curved but not yet cut to length.

Next once the paint is dry I will pull the hull into shape and fit the stringers and deck supports before the deck goes on. The other option is the leave out the lateral ‘extra’ supports till the hatch is cut , just to make sure things done end up in the wrong place. I hope that with a bit of patient measuring I can fit all the supports now, I suspect the clamping will be easier without the deck on!

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

I managed to get the stringers and foredeck supports glued in yesterday. Today I tidied up a bit, trimmed the excess off the stringers and checked everything was the right shape. It’s close enough I think. I now need to coat the parts of the stringers and supports that won’t be mating with the deck, and then either the deck goes on, or I varnish the cockpit.

I am quite keen to get the deck on, mostly to get it off the floor and allow easier garage use by the rest of the family.

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

That looks great Guy!

I have decided not to use the aft main mast position but to always sail her a a yawl; so instead of cutting the hole for the rear mast position  I am going to extend the coaming to a point at the front (like the ones on the online Waterlust videos).

As I asked Dillon to make my cockpit a bit shorter (approximately 9") than standard (so that I can sit on the back and sail whilst my other half peddles the Hobie Drive), I have also decided to add an additional  deck stiffener to support the 9" overhang.
At the moment I have just finished glassing the underside, so I am looking forward to finishing epoxying the hull so that I can flip it back over and start the internal 'mods'.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Oh, that sounds like some interesting mods Martin. I would love to see your progress on these once you get there.  I imagine that quite often 'Svale' will be paddled by three kids, and occasionally sailed by myself and my wife, lets see if I fit on the standard aft deck! I might have to have a look at yours once you are there.  I got the deck supports epoxied, so with any luck one more coat tonight and then deck goes on tomorrow.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Just did a proper dry fit of the deck, it looks a better fit width wise now the sides have been pulled together. However it's not easy to get the deck joined to the shear clamp all the way round. Looks like I am going to need either a lot of weight, or a log of straps, or lots of everything to get it nicely clamped down. Has anyone watching here got any tips on how best to get the deck really tightly 'tied down' while the resin sets?

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Hi Guy. Yes. I have been wondering about that!

I see in the 'manual' that it mentions using 'temporary fasteners'. Do you think this means small screws? This is the only way I can see of doing the job completely satisfactorily. When I was struggling with the breasthooks, I wished I had thought of using a temporary screw/bolt earlier.

I think some guidance from Dillon at this stage would be very helpful to all of us.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

I am just back from the shops with a load of cling film and tape, will see if that works. I am pretty sure I have seen people wrapping the boat in cling film... otherwise maybe some screws or tacks might do the job.  I think the various kayak videos I have seen use tacks to attach the deck. I will report back!

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Cling film pretty hopeless. Tape better. Tacks best so far!

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Well, the deck is on. My advice, now I have done the job, is probably not to do it like I did! In the end I went all round the deck with little tacks. These are fine where the deck is not under too much stress. In other places these were not strong enough. There I used screws in two places, but didn’t like that either. The best would probably be tie down webbing straps. But lots of them. I only had three, and that was no way near enough. Tacks went in roughly every 10 cm or so in the end.

Tacks - not bad

These are great, as the metal work lies flat against the wood, without damaging it, but you will need a lot

Over the cockpit these are super, (I think over the decked areas they would eat there way into the deck)  but I only have one, the other is holding the hull ‘together’

Oh, and obviously it’s important to tile the whole thing, just to make sure right??

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Well done Guy. Many thanks for blazing the trail.
How many ratchet straps do you think we need?

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

That's a good question Martin. I would go for maybe four ratcheting straps over the cockpit area, and probably 8 distributed along the rest of the boat, something of that order anyway. I guess the rule will the the same as with clamps, more than you think you need! I will take the straps and weights off later today once it has had a bit of heat on in the garage just to make sure the resin has properly cured and report back on how well the job appears to have gone.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Success! we have a deck. Looks like it seems to have worked ok. The few screws I used came out fine, but have left large holes that will need filling. The tacks seem to have worked fine. There are a few places where the deck doesn't quite marry to the shear clamp all the way, I think mostly due to the profile I planed into the shear clamp not being perfect. Near the bow and stern the deck can't bend much (side to side I am thinking) as it's quite narrow. Here the shear clamp should be planed to be a bit flatter than it sits naturally. I didn't get the profile quite right here and now have a little gap to fill. In some places the deck overlaps the hull, and in others it doesn't. I guess my boat is not quite perfectly symmetrical, but not so much that I am worried about it. So, next up will be cutting off the excess deck where there is some overlap, and filling the few places where there are small gaps before the deck gets its glass.

Excited crew!

Last edited by Bergen_Guy (23 Apr 2020 10:17 am)

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Well done! It looks really good. I understand what you say about the shear clamps not being horizontal at the bow and stern and the deck not bending much. I did wonder how the surfaces would marry up.
Thanks to your advice, I will order a dozen  ratchet straps straight away.
Keep up the good work.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Check the type: you need more of this type

As they sit flush on the surface.

And a few of this type!

Which needs ‘space’ around it to ratchet properly. I suspect these would cause damage on the soft wooden deck!

MartinC

Member

Registered: 3 Apr 2020

Posts: 341

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Got it! Thanks.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Mast steps cut, again using a drill, chisel and sandpaper.

Bergen_Guy

Member

Registered: 6 Feb 2020

Posts: 352

Re: Waterlust sailing canoe in Norway

Just been all round the deck filling in a tiny gap at the edge between the deck and the shear clamp. In most places it was tiny, but in some places it was a few mm. So I filled it with thickened epoxy. Maybe if I had planed the shear clamp to a different, slightly flatter profile it would have sat a bit better. Otherwise I am happy with how the deck has gone on, and next I will go round with masking tape to prepare for glassing over the deck. Not quite certain how I will handle the inside of the cockpit edge, as I don't want to have any hard edges of glass sticking out there. I imagine I will try to trim the cloth a little large and try and wrap it round the edge. I don't know if that will work very well or not, as its a super tight radius.